path: root/src/inc/bts-suga-pre-debut.htm

<nav class="table-of-contents capital">
	<ol>
		<a href="#top">back to top</a>
		<li>
			<a href="{$bts-rm-pre-debut}" id="goto-rm">RM</a>
		</li>
	</ol>
</nav>

<pre>
  This is a rendered version of <a href="https://old.reddit.com/r/bangtan/comments/bnsomu/suga_predebut_history/">this reddit post</a> saved for ease of reading.
</pre>

<hr>

<h2>Suga pre-debut history</h2>

<p>
	This covers everything I’ve found about Yoongi from 2008 until debut. Some
	parts of this might be a little repetitive if you’ve read my other posts on
	Namjoon and Bangtan’s pre-debut history, but I wanted to make this accessible
	for people who haven’t read those, too.
</p>

<p>
	The first hint of Yoongi is from January 2008 in the Jungle Radio fancafe.
	Jungle Radio was a big hip hop community fancafe for amateur rappers. It’s
	also where Namjoon was also most active pre-debut.
</p>

<figure>
	<img alt="Post by Min Yoongi asking to level up in the Jungle Radio Fancafe" src="/media/content/bts-pre-debut/suga1.png">
	<figcaption>
		Post by Min Yoongi asking to level up in the Jungle Radio Fancafe.
	</figcaption>
</figure>

<p>
	A user named m.y.k, aged 16 and named Min Yoongi, applied to level up. I’m about 90% sure that this is Yoongi, but I don’t want to confirm it completely because there were actually two Kim Namjoons active at the same time in the past (the other Namjoon was a couple years older and went by K-merc among other aliases) so it’s possible that this is another guy named Yoongi and it’s a coincidence. But I think it’s way more likely that it’s correct than not which is why I’m including it.
</p>

<p>
	In June of 2008, m.y.k uploaded a short beat for other users in the community to use. Assuming m.y.k is Yoongi, this is the earliest producing sample we have of his. The title of the upload post was “컷 앤 페이스트 처녀작 평가부탁드려요 ㅜㅜ” which translates as “first/debut cut and paste [song] please critique it.” It would be the first song Yoongi ever uploaded.
</p>

<p>
	It was <a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w_D4VYimhuw">re-uploaded to
		YouTube</a>
	a few years ago by a channel trying to revive Jungle Radio a bit.
	They’re definitely of the opinion it’s the same Yoongi but as far as I know
	they don’t have any additional information about it.
</p>

<p>
	After that, there are no more posts by m.y.k in Jungle Radio. And even
	worse, I haven’t been able to find any trace of Yoongi from June 2008 until
	May 2010 which is when he shows up with D-town and using the name Gloss.
</p>

<p>
	D-town seems to have formed around April 2009 as that’s when their first
	group song was uploaded. The members at the time were (낙션) Nakshun, Tr.J,
	Baby J., J.won, and Erika. Except for Nakshun and Erika, all the members seem
	to have been different by the time Yoongi was performing with them a year
	later. D-town used to have their own fancafe, but it’s long been closed so
	unfortunately we don’t have a good source of information about who was in it
	and when.
</p>

<p>
	There was another fancafe that wasn’t specific to D-town but was used by
	Daegu rappers in general. Unfortunately, as far as I can tell Yoongi never
	posted there (or else he deleted all his posts). Nakshun was active on it as
	well as on Jungle Radio, though, as was Reflow, who Yoongi would eventually
	produce a song for.
</p>

<p>
	So what was Yoongi doing from Jun 2008 to May 2010? It’s possible that he may
	have uploaded a few more songs during this time, but I think the number was
	probably small because he never leveled up in Jungle Radio and in a <a href="https://yoongi-net.tumblr.com/post/174632588578/trans-bts-japan-official-fanclub-magazine">2014
		interview</a>
	for BTS Official Fanclub Magazine Yoongi said that he composed songs
	as a hobby in middle school, but didn’t get serious about it until high school.
	He was, however, <a href="https://sugasuite.tumblr.com/post/149178106008/interview-160819-agust-d-for-grazia-september">working
		part time</a>
	in a music studio in Daegu and selling beats
	he made, so it’s likely that a lot more Min Yoongi beats are out there but
	probably uncredited toward him unfortunately.
</p>

<p>
	In both interviews Yoongi indicates that he was composing music
	significantly before he started rapping. He also said in the fanclub interview
	that he didn’t start rapping properly until he joined D-town in his first year
	of high school which would have been in 2009/10 (he had rapped by himself
	since elementary school).
</p>

<p>
	In May 2010, Yoongi finally reappears posting as <a href="https://m.pann.nate.com/talk/pann/201800070">Gloss on PANN</a>. He
	uploaded the song, <a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4bPlQUYuiQw">“518-062”</a>, a song produced by him and rapped by D-town’s
	leader, Nakshun. The song was originally made for a competition for a festival
	honoring the democratic uprising in Gwangju in 1980. It was uploaded as a
	video, which is easier to see on YouTube (the YouTube uploader also added
	English and Vietnamese subtitles).
</p>

<p>
	In July 2010, Yoongi was part of a group song with other D-town members
	called “인생의 진리지 (The Truth of Life).” With Yoongi on the track were
	D-town members Lucid P and The Smile. Each member produced their own beat and
	the track was mixed by Yoongi. As far as I know no one has done a translation
	of the song yet so I’ll include the lyrics in full below.
</p>

<blockquote>
	<p>
		Glossso fresh G's in the building내랩을 들으면 느끼는 신선한
		feeling인생의 진리? you know나는 몰라 근데 윤호는 알어그 꼬라지 보면 눈을
		감어이씬은 여유롭지 않어니가 쉽게 발 디딜만큼 쉽지 않어free style new style
		그딴거 다 필요없지G's new style 그게 바로 인생의 진리지
	</p>

	<p>
		lucid.p너는 내게 밀리지 그건 인생의 진리지내가 100(백)이라고 쳐 , 너는 그저
		일(ill)이지무슨일을 해도 너는 내게는 못이기지그래 포기가 단하나의 길이지너는
		나를 막지못해, 내목에서나오는말들을 어서 빨리 메모해둬나는 나와 경쟁할뿐
		어서빨리비켜그렇지않으면 곧나와부딪혀
	</p>

	<p>
		the smile
	</p>

	<p>
		내머리 부터 발끝가지 가 다 진리
	</p>

	<p>
		무슨 말을하던간에 내 입에선다 간지 가나
	</p>

	<p>
		모두 말하지 아직 부족한 놈들은 다
	</p>

	<p>
		집에가 지금 여기선 뭘더 말하던가
	</p>

	<p>
		다 씹혀 난 항상 내스탈만을 고수하고 지켜
	</p>

	<p>
		그만 닫고 채워 니 지퍼 내 가말할땐
	</p>

	<p>
		듣고 생각하고 잘 맞춰서 행동해
	</p>
</blockquote>

<p>
	Unfortunately, the audio file for the song no longer exists. I’m not sure when
	it disappeared or if there’s any chance that someone else might have preserved
	it but I haven’t been able to come across it.
</p>

<p>
	It’s also interesting that for all the pre-debut raps we have, Yoongi always
	begins by saying a variant of “So fresh G’s in the building.” He has the same
	opening in “Swagger,” “Diss,” and his first audition video. So it was kind of
	like the “Suga” he frequently says now before starting a verse.
</p>

<figure>
	<img alt="Poster advertising the D-town Vol 2 Concert in Daegu" src="/media/content/bts-pre-debut/suga2.jpg">
	<figcaption>
		Poster advertising the D-town Vol 2 Concert in Daegu.
	</figcaption>
</figure>

<p>
	In August 2010, Yoongi performed with D-town at the D-town Vol 2 concert at a
	Daegu club called, “Live-in-D.” As part of the advertising for the show, a
	member of D-town <a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GZ5bsuLSM8Q">made a
		video</a>
	showing all the performers from a previous
	concert. From the way the other members are paired up in the footage, I think it
	was probably taken at the D-town Vol 1 concert in March 2010. Yoongi/Gloss
	doesn’t appear listed on the poster, but may have participated in the concert
	anyway (Namjoon also doesn’t appear on the earliest posters for shows he
	performed at).
</p>

<figure>
	<img alt="Poster for the D-town Vol 1 concert" src="/media/content/bts-pre-debut/suga3.jpg">
	<figcaption>
		Poster for the D-town Vol 1 concert which is the likely source of
		most of the concert video footage. I can't guarantee that Yoongi also
		performed at this show, but it's my best guess.
	</figcaption>
</figure>

<p>
	It’s also possible that the footage of Yoongi came from some other concert since
	Live-in-D was a very popular venue for amateur and underground rappers in Daegu.
</p>

<p>
	The Hit It Auditions for Bangtan opened at the end of August 2010 with the Final
	Auditions planned for October 2010. In <a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h43Cr6CGo8E">“724148”</a>
	from Agust D Yoongi talks a bit
	about the audition process and his pre-debut life.
</p>

<blockquote>
	<p>
		“It’s the rapping competition organized by Bang Sihyuk
	</p>

	<p>
		Bang Sihyuk is that guy
	</p>

	<p>
		Who worked with that Baek Jiyoung that-
	</p>

	<p>
		Hyungnim, isn’t that the guy who wrote
	</p>

	<p>
		“Like being shot by a gun”
	</p>

	<p>
		So that’s how I entered the competition
	</p>

	<p>
		With my crew hyungs
	</p>

	<p>
		They said we should pass the preliminary round first
	</p>

	<p>
		To reach the final round
	</p>

	<p>
		Ok that’s easy peasy
	</p>

	<p>
		The beat they gave us to rap
	</p>

	<p>
		I changed the entire thing
	</p>

	<p>
		I started re-arranging the beats
	</p>

	<p>
		Look at this, who would do this
	</p>

	<p>
		If you were me, would you do this?
	</p>

	<p>
		Listen, which company would, huh?
	</p>

	<p>
		Say no to this genius.
	</p>
</blockquote>

<p>
	Everyone auditioning had to use one of the four songs released. Yoongi used
	“Seventeen” (one of the two songs Namjoon rapped on) and made some modifications
	to the beat which caught the attention of the Hit It Judges. You can listen to
	differences by comparing <a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HEo-2BsNluM">Namjoon’s original</a>, and
	<a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QBwBU2w5ddI">Yoongi’s modified version</a>. (I'm
	fairly sure Pdogg did the beats for all 4 songs but I haven't been able to
	re-find the interview that said that).
</p>

<p>
	Leading up to October, there was a round of online voting on an app/website
	called Love Beat. 3 finalists were selected from the Love Beat voting and
	judges opinions and Yoongi was advertised as the Love Beat 1st place winner on
	the poster for the Hit It Audition Final
</p>

<figure>
	<img alt="Poster for the Hit It Final Audition concert" src="/media/content/bts-pre-debut/suga4.jpg">
	<figcaption>
		Poster for the Hit It Final Audition concert.
	</figcaption>
</figure>

<p>
	The Hit It Final Audition was held at NB2 in Hongdae and was a rap battle
	tournament which promised the winner a place in Bangtan. Only the final round
	between Yoongi and Choi Ikje (i11evn) has <a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FdW0M0fRnc4">surviving video</a>.
</p>

<p>
	Although Yoongi came in second to I11evn, Big Hit brought them both in, Yoongi’s
	producing playing a strong role in him being taken on. Yoongi has said in
	multiple interviews that his initial plan was to be a producer at Big Hit, but
	as far as I can tell he was always a Bangtan member as well (other members like
	Jimin and Jin spent a long period as trainees without being officially assigned
	to Bangtan).
</p>

<p>
	At some point Yoongi had a profile picture on the Big Hit website which you can
	see in this picture below. I’m not sure if it was during the audition process or
	after that it was uploaded because I’ve never found a firsthand source for it.
	In any case, he mentions being in D-town and writing, composing, producing and
	rapping. He also lists himself as a 2nd year high school student in Daegu, so my
	guess is that this might have been uploaded during the Love Beat voting process
	but if not it would have been shortly afterward.
</p>

<figure>
	<img alt="Yoongi's profile on the Big Hit website" src="/media/content/bts-pre-debut/suga5.png">
	<figcaption>
		Yoongi's profile on the Big Hit website. I've only found this from secondary
		sources so I don't have a firm date for it but it would have been sometime in
		2010. There's also an option to click and see a rap video of his.
	</figcaption>
</figure>

<p>
	Yoongi moved to Seoul on November 7th, 2010 and into the dorms on November 13th.
	He also re-recorded his rap battle songs against i11evn which are the pre-debut
	tracks <a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kdAV7tJf0Pg">“Swagger”</a>
	and
	<a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jmG1EhBntCA">“Diss”</a>. “Diss” is slightly different from the live version
	because Yoongi had originally ended by saying it was obvious he won, but in the
	recorded version he added the line, “But I lost. Damn.”
</p>

<figure>
	<img alt="Cover art for Reflow's mixtape Represent" src="/media/content/bts-pre-debut/suga6.jpg">
	<figcaption>
		Yoongi's profile on the Big Hit website
	</figcaption>
</figure>

<p>
	Although it wasn’t released until September 2011, sometime in the summer of
	2010 Yoongi made the beat for another Daegu underground rapper named Reflow.
	The song was called “Who Am I” and was on Reflow’s mixtape Represent. The
	mixtape also included a remixed version of the song <a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y74CxrkkoVo">featuring Basick</a>
	(who
	was also approached about being in Bangtan at one point). Yoongi was credited
	as Min Yoongi rather than Gloss in the <a href="http://archive.hiphopplaya.com/magazine/article/view.html?category=2&category2=0&mode=&page=172&sort=1&num=7905&keyfield=&key=">track
		list</a>. The only version I’ve found of the original rather than the remix
	is this <a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SajtQocxTSo">live
		performance</a>.
</p>

<p>
	In August 2011, Yoongi appeared on his first Bangtan song, the original version
	of <a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LCkil2Gocrs">“Satoori Rap”</a>
	with Namjoon and Hoseok. By this time, all the old members of
	Bangtan were out and the only ones still officially in were Namjoon, Yoongi, and
	Hoseok according to Hoseok’s 2013 <a href="https://bantan.tumblr.com/post/177907541434/jp-fc-vol-1-my-biography-with-bts-j-hope">Japan
		Fanclub interview</a>.
</p>

<p>
	At some point in 2011 or 2012, Yoongi injured his shoulder in a car accident
	while working a part time job as a delivery boy. According to <a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RmZ3DPJQo2k">Burn the Stage episode
		3</a>, he hid the injury from the company for a while because he was afraid
	he would get cut from the group if they found out. He also had to give up
	dancing which he used to enjoy. He also mentions the injury in the lyrics for
	<a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DB_AP7DLQ0w">“The Last”</a>
	on Agust
	D.
</p>

<p>
	In 2012, he appears as a backup dancer for <a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nbAagOhXbJ0">GLAM and SeeU</a>
	and he also has a cameo
	in Jo Kwon’s <a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HWgH0DsD0pQ">“Im Da One”</a>
	music video.
</p>